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 Post subject: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: Feb 25, 2012 1:28 PM 
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I recently received the following e-mail from Sarah Hamby:

I'm doing a research project about comic books and superheroes and how they changed during the World War 2 era. If you could answer some questions for me that would be great!

- What differences in comics were made in the World War 2 era?
- How did superheroes change (appearance, attitude, story lines, etc.)?
- Did the superheroes travel overseas? i know Batman and Superman stayed in America mostly, but what about others?

Any other information you can think of would be great and even if you only have time for a couple of sentences that would be helpful.


I ask for some more information on her project and received the following:

I've done a research paper on how superheroes and comics have impacted society and it was really interesting. I decided to do another one about comics and superheroes because it was so interesting. This time I'm doing it only on how comics changed during the World War 2 era. On a lot of sites it seemed like they were more about fighting Nazi's and Japanese people. I know Superman and Batman kind of stayed on the home front in America, but Superwoman seemed to get really popular around that time. Is that right? I had read that she went to Europe to fight with soldiers and didn't just stay in America. Did comics get more popular during the war? I know they promoted supporting the war and buying war bonds. Did they do any other advertisements in the comics for the war? Any information would be helpful. I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out!


Maybe some of you with expertise in this are could provide some answers to these questions.

Mike M


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: Feb 25, 2012 7:22 PM 
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I recieved an e-mail as well. I sent her a link to this thread, and mentioned I would try to post my input within a few days.


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: Feb 26, 2012 2:49 PM 
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Sure, I'll take a crack. A couple of thoughts --

--One interesting angle on how/why comics changed during WWII is that nearly all of the early writers and artists were Jewish. Anti-German (and anti-Hitler) comic covers and stories started to appear in the US as early as 1939, a full 2 years before America officially entered the war, by creators that were well aware of the atrocities taking place in Europe... many of whom were likely disgusted that America was staying neutral in the conflict. A couple of good sources on this are Men of Tomorrow by Gerard Jones (an excellent social history of the early roots of the industry), and Michael Chabon's Kavalier and Clay (while fictional, it's based on real people and events and gives you a great feel for the forces that shaped the industry in its infancy).

--During the war, the comic book absolutely exploded in popularity. Print runs were in the millions, and comics accounted for a good percentage of the reading material that was shipped overseas to the soldiers. Characters like Superman and Captain Marvel became patriotic icons, and comic companies contributed their time and talents to the homefront side of the war effort (support and fundraising campaigns for war bonds, etc).

--In terms of storylines, there were definitely US-superhero-vs-Germans & vs-Japanese stories. Some of the depictions of the Japanese were extremely racist and offensive by today's standards. A ton of patriotric-themed superheroes were created in 1941-1942... The Shield, Captain America, The Star-Spangled Kid, etc etc.

So, it's kind of a sprawling topic but there are lots of interesting angles to it. I really recommend the Jones book for some good background. Sarah, feel free to chime in here if you have more questions.

Jon :righton:


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: Feb 26, 2012 9:49 PM 
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Hre is an article from All in Color for a Dime writen by Don Thompson around 1970.

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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: Feb 26, 2012 9:49 PM 
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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: Feb 26, 2012 9:50 PM 
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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: Feb 26, 2012 9:50 PM 
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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: Feb 26, 2012 9:50 PM 
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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: Feb 26, 2012 9:51 PM 
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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: Feb 26, 2012 9:51 PM 
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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 07, 2012 1:18 AM 
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After the war what happened to all the patriotic superheroes like Fighting Yank, Captain Flag, Spy Smasher, and The Unknown Soldier? i'm guessing they just died off. Are their comic stories very rare now? are they even wanted by anyone?

Also i found out the creators of captain america were jewish. do you think the stories they made of him were because they were jewish. If world war II never happened i believe Captain America never would have been created.
At first did people agree with Captain America? i know he was created and published before America itself entered the war. In the comic book stories Captain America clearly took a side. After the war, where did the stories go? he couldn't still fight nazis. we had already defeated them. Did he end up fighting crime in the streets? what happened after the war ended is what im asking

Once again i appreciate any time that any of you take to answer my questions. this paper is so interesting to me and i have no idea how comics have never interested me before this year. there is so much information from them. thank you!
Sarah Hamby


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 07, 2012 8:21 AM 
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SarahHamby wrote:
After the war what happened to all the patriotic superheroes like Fighting Yank, Captain Flag, Spy Smasher, and The Unknown Soldier? i'm guessing they just died off. Are their comic stories very rare now? are they even wanted by anyone?

Also i found out the creators of captain america were jewish. do you think the stories they made of him were because they were jewish. If world war II never happened i believe Captain America never would have been created.
At first did people agree with Captain America? i know he was created and published before America itself entered the war. In the comic book stories Captain America clearly took a side. After the war, where did the stories go? he couldn't still fight nazis. we had already defeated them. Did he end up fighting crime in the streets? what happened after the war ended is what im asking

Once again i appreciate any time that any of you take to answer my questions. this paper is so interesting to me and i have no idea how comics have never interested me before this year. there is so much information from them. thank you!
Sarah Hamby


Hi Sarah! This is a very quick reply. If I can research it more in depth I will (although I'm sure someone else will beat me to it). What happened to the other patriotic heroes you mentioned is that the companies that printed them either went out of business, which happened quite a bit in the Golden Age, or they switched focus on other genres that were becoming popular (i.e. Western, Sci-Fi, etc.). I know Dynamite has used the Fighting Yank recently in one of their series whose name is escaping me right now (any help guys). As for their original appearances, some of them have been reprinted so it'd be possible to find them there. The original books still exist and can be found with some effort. There are still people that collect the books from the Golden Age and even will want those character's appearances in particular.

Captain America was very much a product of his time. No one can say with any certainty whether or not he would have been created if World War II never happened. I'm positive that the war did provide some inspiration in his creation though. As for where the stories went, I haven't read any of the reprints of his late Golden Age exploits but I do know that the series actually ended for a while then had a very brief return in the 50's before going away again. He did face other menaces besides Nazis but they were his main foes. The Red Scare and McCarthyism made Communists a good target for Captain America as well.

Like I said, this is just what I remember/think happened. I'll do some more digging when I get the chance but hopefully someone else can provide more details.


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 07, 2012 11:45 AM 
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Most superhero titles died out after WWII. By the early 50s comics were almost all westerns, horror, Archie, romance, crime and funny animal. The only superheros that were published continuously from WWII to the start of the Silver Age were Batman, Superman and Wonder Woman. Marvel cancelled Human Torch, Sub-Mariner and Captain America in the late 40s. As mentioned above, they tried restarting them in the early 50's, but that effort only lasted about a year. During that brief period they were fighting the communists.


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 07, 2012 11:48 AM 
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If you want to see what was on the newsstand in any give month/year you can visit this site:

http://www.dcindexes.com/timemachine/


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 07, 2012 12:02 PM 
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Hi Sarah,

Short on time, but I'll try and direct you to a few solid sources.

Will Brooker provides some commentary in on the changes to Batman (and GA Superheroes in general) that you might find helpful.
Brooker, Will. Batman Unmasked: Analyzing a Cultural Icon. London: Continuum, 2001. Print.

While Matt Costello's work focuses on the Cold War era, I think that it might be helpful to briefly look at where these heroes went immediately following WWII.
Costello, Matthew. Secret Identity Crisis: Comic Books & the Unmasking of Cold War America. New York: Continuum, 2009. Print.

Gerard Jones is essentially required reading for anyone who wants to collect or study Golden Age comics. It focuses in the rise of the medium prior to WWII and you also get a good feel for the cultural climate that created, shaped, and direct the industry from the 1920s/30s until the present day.
Jones, Gerard. The Men of Tomorrow. New York: Basic Books, 2004. Print.

For a source discussing the feminine perspective on comics, this one is a decent one (and a very easy read).
Madrid, Mike. The Supergirls. MN: Exterminating Angels Press, 2009. Print.

Although Wertham wrote his seminal book during the McCarthy-Red Scare period, it's important to know he wasn't the first person to attack comics, particularly in the post-WWII era. However, his work is the definitive piece that gave rise to the Comics Code, which would effectively put an end to the epic publishing comics enjoyed during WWII.
Wertham, Fredric. Seduction of the Innocent: Revised Edition. New York: Reinhart & Co., 1954. Print.

Earlier, I noticed you asked whether the comic creators Jewish background factored into the nationalistic / propaganda in comics. While I think it is safe to say many comic creators, like millions of Americans at the time, we anxious to see the Nazi regime put down, I'm hesitant to attribute the zeal of some comics predominantly to this component of their identity. Remember: Be wary of reading into authorial intent. Additionally, a large number of comic creators of the most popular books were Jewish--Bob Kane, Jerry Robinson, Joe Shuster, and Jerry Siegel to name only a few (there's also Eisner, Lee, Kirby, Simon, and on, and on). While Batman and Superman engaged in their patriotic duty ON their covers, the stories were often devoid of such patriotic themes and tropes. Brooker addresses this, and I agree with his assessment. So, not all Jewish creators were so eager--or at least, not all editors & publishers, some of whom were also Jewish--to jump on the bandwagon. I don't think it stems from a lack of patriotism, as there are other possible reasons (again, Brooker speaks to this if I remember correctly).

Anyhow, I hope this helps you in your research, and I'm sorry I missed this thread!

-Forrest

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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 07, 2012 12:56 PM 
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Monkeyman wrote:
If you want to see what was on the newsstand in any give month/year you can visit this site:

http://www.dcindexes.com/timemachine/

This is a great resource, and really brings home visually what a dearth of superheroes there was after WWII. I gave it a quick whirl with the date January 1950 -- according to the site, there were 113 books out that month, but no more than 10 (!) or so were superhero titles -- the DC Bat/Supe/WW titles as Mike mentioned, plus Captain Marvel and the Marvel Family soldiered on into the early 50s before the lawsuit shut them down.


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 07, 2012 8:20 PM 
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Thanks for all the great information! I'm looking into all the books and threads you are giving me and they are all great! i really liked the newsstand thread. it was really cool to see how comic covers changed over the years. You mentioned that marvel was shut down after the 50's.. what was that about? i will definitely look into dynamite and how they used fighting yank recently! i'd really like to see how they brought him back into the story and what kind of role he played in the story.
i know the golden age is when most popular characters from today were made. do you think that characters that are still being made today will be able to flourish as much as superman and batman and wonder woman without having a world war or global issue going on?
Have there been any new up and coming characters created?
I'm sorry if these questions seem stupid, i'm just not up on all the comic information.
Thanks for all the great links and information!


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 07, 2012 9:29 PM 
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SarahHamby wrote:
Thanks for all the great information! I'm looking into all the books and threads you are giving me and they are all great! i really liked the newsstand thread. it was really cool to see how comic covers changed over the years. You mentioned that marvel was shut down after the 50's.. what was that about?

Captain Marvel was one of the most popular GA superheroes of the 1940s (arguably "the" most popular superhero in terms of sales, though he is less well-known today), but DC sued the company that created him, claiming he was an intentional infringement of their Superman character, and the lawsuit was ultimately successful. You can read a bit more here --> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_C ... blications

SarahHamby wrote:
i know the golden age is when most popular characters from today were made. do you think that characters that are still being made today will be able to flourish as much as superman and batman and wonder woman without having a world war or global issue going on?
Have there been any new up and coming characters created?

Superheroes had a second wave of popularity in the 1960s, thanks to Marvel Comics (no relation to Captain Marvel above), which created characters such as Spiderman, The X-Men, Iron Man, The Fantastic Four and The Hulk. Wolverine (of the X-men) is a very popular character from the 1970s. I'd have to say there aren't too many mega-iconic characters from the 80s onward ... the reasons for that continue to be debated on comic chat boards. ;)

SarahHamby wrote:
I'm sorry if these questions seem stupid, i'm just not up on all the comic information.
Thanks for all the great links and information!

No trouble, ask away. :righton:


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 08, 2012 7:29 AM 
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Point Five wrote:
SarahHamby wrote:
Thanks for all the great information! I'm looking into all the books and threads you are giving me and they are all great! i really liked the newsstand thread. it was really cool to see how comic covers changed over the years. You mentioned that marvel was shut down after the 50's.. what was that about?

Captain Marvel was one of the most popular GA superheroes of the 1940s (arguably "the" most popular superhero in terms of sales, though he is less well-known today), but DC sued the company that created him, claiming he was an intentional infringement of their Superman character, and the lawsuit was ultimately successful. You can read a bit more here --> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_C ... blications

SarahHamby wrote:
i know the golden age is when most popular characters from today were made. do you think that characters that are still being made today will be able to flourish as much as superman and batman and wonder woman without having a world war or global issue going on?
Have there been any new up and coming characters created?

Superheroes had a second wave of popularity in the 1960s, thanks to Marvel Comics (no relation to Captain Marvel above), which created characters such as Spiderman, The X-Men, Iron Man, The Fantastic Four and The Hulk. Wolverine (of the X-men) is a very popular character from the 1970s. I'd have to say there aren't too many mega-iconic characters from the 80s onward ... the reasons for that continue to be debated on comic chat boards. ;)


While not on the same level as the Trifecta (Superman, Batman, and Spider-Man respectively), I would argue the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles have enjoyed mainstream popularity for going on 25+ years (30 years in 2014). But I know you (Jon) aren't saying there weren't ANY icons to emerge--just not as many. ;) You're also spot on in pointing out that the majority of the heroes that ARE well known today hail primarily from the Silver Age of comics, particularly what is referred to as the dawning of the Marvel Age (1961-63 being the period of origin for many of these heroes).
It's also commonly overlooked the X-Men didn't take off until the 70s as you point out when Claremont stepped in as the original team nearly had their title cancelled after going into reprint.


SarahHamby wrote:
I'm sorry if these questions seem stupid, i'm just not up on all the comic information.
Thanks for all the great links and information!

No trouble, ask away. :righton:

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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 08, 2012 8:30 AM 
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One reason I think that there aren't any new iconic super-heroes is that the culture has changed. Back in the 1930's, there were fewer choices of entertainment for kids than there is today. Video games and television weren't even invented yet. Movies were pretty much in their formative years, just getting the ability to have sound in them. Kids gravitated more to books and magazines (including comics) than they do today. With that being the case, the heroes became very important to them. This holds close to being true in the 1960's as well with the resurgence of the super-heroes.

Today, kids have 100+ channels to choose from on the television, video games that have movie-style graphics, movies that have nearly real special effects, the Internet available on a phone, etc. They don't need to turn to comics for entertainment as they did in the past. Most characters created after the 1970's go through cycles of being popular. I think anyone who has been collecting in the 1980's and 1990's can remember times when characters like Ghost Rider, Sub-Mariner, Cable, Venom, Carnage, Punisher, etc. were the "hot" characters for a while (I mainly followed Marvel but I'm sure the same thing happened at DC as well with the Teen Titans being one that springs to mind). The problem is, none of them stuck. They couldn't break through to become a truly "iconic" figure.


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 Post subject: Re: Information Request - Comics during WWII
PostPosted: May 08, 2012 4:19 PM 
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SarahHamby wrote:
You mentioned that marvel was shut down after the 50's.. what was that about?


Actually, Marvel didn't exist in the 50's. The company that is known today as Marvel started producing comics under Timely back in the 30's. They then changed their name to Atlas (which is what they were producing under in the '50s) before becoming Marvel in the early '60s. This is a VERY brief timeline but it touches on the company's major name changes.

When they were Timely, their "Big 3" heroes were Captain America, the Human Torch, and the Sub-Mariner. When super-heroes fell out of favor, the books featuring these characters stopped being printed (or the titles were changed to something else). In the '50s, Atlas brought back these characters briefly but apparently they didn't quite catch on so they faded out again. Timely and Atlas were both continuing to put out different books though. They just weren't using these characters.

After the super-hero had caught on again, Stan Lee wanted to bring the "Big 3" back again. The Human Torch was made a member of the Fantastic Four in Fantastic Four #1 (it was a different person with the same exact abilities). The original Human Torch was an android that was coated in a material that caught fire when exposed to air (if I remember correctly). The FF member, Johnny Storm, gained his abilities through exposure to cosmic radiation.

Next, the Sub-Mariner returned in Fantastic Four #4. He was the same person from the Golden Age. He had lost his memory but gained it back. Finally, in Avengers #4, Captain America was found inclosed in ice by the Avengers. The super-soldier formula allowed him to enter a state of suspended animation instead of being killed by the cold.


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